How good are we at taking turns? Threesomes

Today’s episode explores the downward spiral Figs went through after a conversation with a friend who confidently declared that only two things end a marriage: babies and threesomes.

Figs has thoughts...

In this episode, she challenges that claim by asking the uncomfortable (and fun) questions: Are threesome fantasies actually that common? Is this really a male-centric fantasy? Is it an even split where one person pushes to have a threesome and the other partner complies? Who’s even having threesomes? How do they impact relationships in real life? And finally, is it possible for a threesome to benefit a relationship rather than destroy it?

Citations and Stuff I read:

Armstrong, H. L., & Reissing, E. D. (2014). Attitudes toward casual sex, dating, and committed relationships with bisexual partners. Journal of bisexuality, 14(2), 236-264.

Johnston, S. W. (2025). “My First Threesome with Them Was a Religious Experience”: A Mixed-Methods Study of Symbiosexual Experiences. Archives of Sexual Behavior, 1-18.

Jonason, P. K., & Marks, M. J. (2009). Common vs. uncommon sexual acts: Evidence for the sexual double standard. Sex Roles, 60(5), 357-365.

Joyal, C. C., Cossette, A., & Lapierre, V. (2015). What exactly is an unusual sexual fantasy?. The journal of sexual medicine, 12(2), 328-340.

Kulibert, D., Moran, J. B., Preman, S., Vannier, S. A., & Thompson, A. E. (2021). Sex on the Screen: A Content Analysis of Free Internet Pornography Depicting Mixed-Sex Threesomes from 2012–2020. European Journal of Investigation in Health, Psychology and Education, 11(4), 1555-1570. https://doi.org/10.3390/ejihpe11040110

Morris, H., Chang, I. J., & Knox, D. (2016). Three’sa crowd or bonus?: College students’ threesome experiences. Journal of Positive Sexuality, 2(November), 62-76

Pandey, M. K., Thakral, H., Mishra, P., & Rao, T. S. (2025). Decoding Threesomes: Insights into Motivations, Gender Dynamics, and Societal Impact. Journal of Psychosexual Health, 26318318241299028.

Pornhub (2025, March 18). 2024 year in Review. Pornhub Insights. https://www.pornhub.com/insights/2024-year-in-review#categories 

Scoats, R., Joseph, L. J., & Anderson, E. (2018). ‘I don’t mind watching him cum’: Heterosexual men, threesomes, and the erosion of the one-time rule of homosexuality. Sexualities, 21(1-2), 30-48.

Scoats, R. (2019). ‘If there is no homo, there is no trio’: Women’s experiences and expectations of MMF threesomes. Psychology & Sexuality, 10(1), 45-55.

Scoats, R., Anderson, E., & White, A. J. (2021). Exploring gay men's threesomes: Normalization, Concerns, and sexual opportunities. Journal of Bodies, Sexualities, and Masculinities, 2(2), 82-106.

Scoats, R., & Anderson, E. (2019). ‘My partner was just all over her’: jealousy, communication and rules in mixed-sex threesomes. Culture, Health & Sexuality, 21(2), 134-146.

Scoats, R. (2019). Understanding Threesomes: Gender, Sex, and Consensual Non-Monogamy (1st ed.). Routledge. https://doi.org/10.4324/9780429453328

Valovirta, E. (2021). Repeated Pleasure: Reading the Threesome Ménage Romance as Digital Literature. Powerful Prose, 45.

Art: bofenglin

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

So for a little bit of context, in preparing for season one of Things I Meant to Say Naked, all the writing, all the preparing the topics, all the reading the journal articles, and yes, talking to my friends have taken place in the month of September. The reason why is because I personally love September. I love the start of fall. As a Floridian, and maybe a lot of my Floridians can agree with me, I feel like there's a kind of like a reverse seasonal depression in our state because the months of June, July, and August, it is muggy. It is humid, it is hot, and it's crowded. We don't go out. We most of the time we spend it indoors because it's over 100 degrees Fahrenheit. It's not pleasant. And so the month of September is when things start to cool down a little bit, the humidity improves. Yes, it's hurricane season, but we all love a good hurricane party. For me, also, September is the month of fresh new starts. Maybe it's Virgo season, and Virgo season just invigorates me as a Virgo moon, or maybe it's my years in academia, where the month of September is a month of syllabi, it's a move, the month of move-ins, and it's the month of meeting new people. So to me, September means curiosity, intrigue, and banter. I feel like I just became September's biggest sales rep. I love September. And so September now recently has become the month where I get the most visits. And it's the month of where most sex conferences happen. So it's even more intriguing and curious, as you can imagine. And this past September, when I was preparing for the season, for this podcast, for this big project, I got a very surprised visit from an old friend. Her name is Tori, and I haven't seen her in 10 years. Ten years. In 10 years, we have not caught up. I had no idea what was going on in her life, and vice versa. And just out all of a sudden, she told me she was in Colombia and she would like to catch up. So of course I had to. I needed to know how she was doing. So we met up in my favorite cafe and audio bar for brunch. And that brunch became lunch, and that lunch became dinner because we could not stop talking. We had so much to catch up on. I was telling her about my journey in sex therapy to Colombia, and she was telling me about every sordid September and her sage wisdom as a newly sophisticated divorcee. And if I if I may add, there is something about women in their late 20s and early 30s who are divorcees. There's this sophistication, confidence, and wisdom about them that I cannot describe. You have to see it to believe it to experience that kind of light. So when I saw her, I just wanted to soak it up, soak up that light, soak up the wisdom, and learn from her. See what she had to say as a newly sophisticated divorcee. And one part in the conversation, she imparts to me and she says, Figs, there are only two things at the end of marriage. Babies and threesomes. Let me um let me rewind the tape really quick. Babies and threesomes. Threesomes. See, um as a professional, as a woman, as a friend, I can understand babies. What threesomes? You know, I mean, I was I was going through this downward spiral. I was spiraling when she said this. And she took her time. She took her time in that sign. She let me marinate in it, marinate with what she said while she took the slowest, most suave sip of bourbon I have ever seen. Like I said, divorcees, there's this form of sophistication I just can't describe to you. But she was sipping that bourbon, and then she said to me, relieving me of my spiral into madness, she said to me that the monogamous Pandora's box is a threesome because what initially began as an experiment or a gift fantasy, you know you want to give them a fantasy, becomes the expected ritual for birthdays, anniversaries, promotions at work, Easter, Labor Day. Nothing you will do will ever match the novelty and the hedonism of a threesome. After that, all would be compared and depreciated in its comparison. It left me with a lot of thoughts, which is why this is the topic for today's episode, threesomes, because these are the questions I had after that conversation. How much do I need to want to follow through with a threesome? How would I be able to prioritize my pleasure and comfort with a whole new person in a now crowded bed? And how good are we at taking turns? Yeah, like how good are we at taking turns? And can we turn back? I don't know. Let's figure it out. I'm I'm just curious where this will go. I had to, I had to look this up. I I hope you enjoy this episode as much as I did looking this up about threesomes. Have fun, everybody. Welcome to Things I'm Meant to Say Naked, a podcast about mental health, desire, intimacy, and the truths that we carry in our bodies. I'm Figs, a certified sex therapist, a licensed mental health counselor, a lover, and someone who has spent way too much time overthinking and turning that into your career. This show is true education, true commentary, and love letter to the versions of us that don't know what the hell we're doing. We want to feel really good doing it. Some episodes will be just me offering insights, stories, and spicy tastes in the erotic. Others will feature guests, lovers, and maybe a little bit of chaos. So get comfy and let's get into things that we were meant to say naked. Although this podcast explores themes of mental health, relationships, and sexuality, it's for educational and entertainment purposes only and is not a substitute for professional mental health care. If you find yourself struggling, please reach out to a licensed provider in your area. The first thing I had to do was dissect Tori's argument. Because Tori's argument suggests that there's this built-in duality that one partner wants a threesome and the other one just complies. Doesn't really want it. Her argument also suggests that the ones that usually are bringing up suggesting wanting the threesome are men in heterosexual relationships and not women. So I had to look up whether if it really was that split of those who want it and don't want it, if it's really just a 50-50 split, and if it's really a male-centered fantasy. Of course, I had to look it up. Come on. And what I actually found, and what was interesting about all this in preparing for today's episode was coincidentally, I was actually reading Justin Lane Miller's book, Tell Me What You Want. It's a great book. I highly recommend it if you haven't read it already. It is based on the largest sexual fantasy survey in the United States. It has over 4,000 participants, which is a really large sample size. I would make an episode talking about that survey and the results, which were super interesting and intriguing. But rather than do that, I'm actually going to tell you to go to his podcast because at the end of the day, it's his research, it's his work, and it's a good podcast. It's called Sex and Psychology. And I believe it's either the first or second episode where he talks about his research and the results of Tell Me What You Want. The reason why I'm suggesting his podcast is because I do like to connect, I like to provide resources, and I like to make referrals. I'm not a selfish therapist where I'm like, give me everything. I want everything. I want all the clients in the world. I want all the listeners in the world. I'm not like that. It's a great podcast. And I mean, it's better to listen to the guy himself who orchestrated this such an amazing project and research topic. So highly recommend it. But I'm going to talk about the results a little bit because what was really interesting about the survey, this large study of 4,000 Americans, was that the most common fantasy of them all, number one, was multi-partner sex. In fact, only 5% of men and 13% of women have never fantasized about group sex. I'm going to repeat that. Only 5% of men, 13% of women, have never fantasized about threesoms, gangbangs, orgies, swinging events, none of that. That means most people, most Americans have fantasized of group sex. And it wasn't just fantasies. Of course, I had to look up porn usage to see if it would really was again that 50-50 split. And is this really a male-centered fantasy? Are the men the ones suggesting a threesome and are the women complying? I had to look it up. A really great resource or just thing to check out in the beginning of the year, every year, is Pornhub Insights. It's so cool. Every year, Pornhub releases statistics on most popular categories, actors, actresses, types of sex that are popular by region, sex, and age. I love it. And so I did look up this past year's insights, and I found that threesomes is the eighth most popular category overall. It's ranked number eight for men, and guess what? Number five for women. Typically, when you look up threesome, usually it's two women in the guy. Just want to make that clear. When you look up threesome on Pornhub. And interestingly enough, Gangbang, which usually is one female participant, actress with multiple more than two men, was ranked number 13 among women. And bisexual male, which is typically a threesome with two guys and a woman, ranked number 15 for women. So it's not just our fantasies, for our porn usage shows that it's not just men that want them, it's also women. And when it came to real life experiences, I had to look it up. Who's having threesome? How common are threesomes? And I found that there's an overall statistic. Most Western studies show that 18% of men and 10% of women have engaged in a threesome. Okay, so it is pretty hard to organize. I am like I've talked about the stigma of threesomes, that's it seems like a male fantasy. So I can see why there's just this huge drop from most people fantasizing versus small proportion of people actually having threesomes. And when it came to mixed sex threesomes, this Canadian study found that 85% of men have fantasized threesomes with two women, and more than half reported fantasizing a threesome with two guys. And the same study found that 56.5% of women, a little more than half, have fantasized a threesome with two men. And I wonder if this number goes up because of the movie Challengers. It was just such a popular movie that has this sort of threesome scene with the two male actors and Zendaya. It's funny how I remember Zendaya's name but not the other two. I'm sorry. What I dislike about this study, this Canadian study, is I couldn't find the number of women, like the percentage of women who have fantasized of having a threesome with two women and a and a guy, but it's okay. You you get the gist. So this is a pretty common fantasy for both sexes. And of course, these studies lack people who are gender diverse and trans. I do apologize for that. The desire for threesomes, it's not rare, it's not niche, and it's not gendered. It's one of the most common sexual fantasies across North America. I'm sure you notice the big gap between fantasizing and watching threesomes versus actually having a threesome. In other words, it's not about who wants a threesome. Maybe it's more so about the stigma revolving around threesomes or a deep fear whether a threesome may actually hurt good relationships. I had to look it up. Is Tori right that a threesome can end a marriage? That was my next question. And does having a threesome mean it will start becoming a regular thing? Like Tori said, once you have a threesome, now every time we go through Labor Day or I have a promotion at work, I expect a threesome. You know what I mean? Is does that become a normalized thing? I had to look it up. So we don't actually know if having a threesome for the first time increases the likelihood of another. But research does show that people who've had one are more open to having another. Yeah, I mean, if you enjoyed the threesome, you probably will like another. There was a study surveying sex life of college students, and they found that those with threesome experiences were more likely to say yes to if there was another opportunity, with men reporting significantly more satisfaction than women afterwards. Okay, this does support Tori's argument just a little bit that this is more satisfying for men and more of a male fantasy, but it does not mean that women do not enjoy it. Okay, so yeah, men tend to like the threesome more than women. They they they they're a little bit more satisfied. It doesn't mean that the women weren't satisfied, it just means they didn't like it. Maybe this is also a product of the orgasm gap, the pleasure gap. If you ever heard about that, a lot of times during sex, we prioritize men achieving orgasm or reaching orgasm and not so much women. So my take is on this is men have a hard time making women come. Imagine making two women come. I don't know. That's my take. That's my take on that, on that statistic of men reporting more satisfaction after a threesome. That's my take. The next question of how did it impact their relationship? What happened to the couples who opened their relationship to a third? Well, the study found that nearly half, 48%, so very close to half, said that having a threesome had no effect on their relationship. It didn't prove, it didn't get worse, and it didn't end. Funny enough, 17% of couples who've had a threesome actually reported feeling closer to their partner, while only 7% said that it led to a breakup. So for the most part, the stakes are relatively low, which raises the final question. Under the right circumstances, how could a threesome actually improve your relationship? Which brings me to the name of today's episode. The title. It'll be great for our relationship, it will save our marriage. No, not at all. And you're gonna hear why, and it's gonna be the great conclusion of today's episode, why that's such a bad idea. So while I talk about how great threesomes are, how it can be great for a relationship, I want you to really ask yourself and ask your partner, are you guys good at taking turns? Threesomes are great, and you're gonna hear how great they are. Threesomes give couples a safe space to explore their sexuality within the context of a relationship. It lets partners explore new dynamics of submission, dominance, topping, bottoming. It's not just those types of dynamics, but also like your sexual orientation. If you find yourself curious, or maybe you're beyond curious, but you find that you want to stay in this relationship, you love this relationship, and your partner also wants you to explore your sexuality within the confines of this relationship. A threesome's great for that. Awesome. We've talked about mixed sex threesomes, wonderful. And we talked about how bisexuality is even a category on Pornhub. It's not just that, it's not just our sexual orientation, it's not just our kinks, but a lot of us, some of us, find that it's a complete turn on watching our partner give and receive from someone else. Or maybe you like the audience. A lot of rope bunnies, so a lot of people who enjoy bondage, who like rope or other ways to be binded, like the aspect of having an audience to being worshipped, put on display. Maybe that's your thing, and maybe a threesome allows it for that audience to grow a little bit more. That's great. A threesome can also benefit those who are neurodiverse. A lot of neurodiverse folks like over-stimulation, like to be overstimulated because it keeps them present. And there is nothing as stimulating. Well, there is some things. Sorry, maybe that's an over-exaggeration, but I will say it's very stimulating to be touched by more than one person. That's if you want stimulation, that's a great way. So, yeah, neurodiverse folks can also benefit from a threesome. Not only that, but threesomes give us the opportunity to test the waters of non-monogamy and the relatively low stake. We talked about how 7% of those who experience a threesome in that one study led to a breakup. So this is also a way for you both to explore non-monogamy. Great. If that's something you both are interested in. As a sex therapist, what I love about threesomes is that if done right, it forces straight couples to communicate like queer couples. And I think I've said this before, not just about poly folks, but the straights have a lot to learn, much to learn from the queer community. Because a lot of heterosexuals and straits, heterosexual straits, and it's interchangeable, since they are considered the norm and they're under the guise of the norm. I noticed that a lot of heterosexual relationships ride on assumptions and miss out on vulnerable conversations that can lead to understanding of compatibility and pleasure. For example, I mentioned in my previous episode how in gay online dating, you already know if someone's a top or a bottom or is a little bit more submissive or a little bit more dominant from the jump. So you rule out a lot of people that you may not be sexually compatible with in straight dating, that doesn't really happen until much later. If it happens, a lot of couples don't have these conversations because there's an assumption that a man should be a certain way and a woman should be another way. And I think I will have an episode another time about good girl sex and how we need to unlearn good girl sex, that women should be submissive or a men should be dominant, and that's not the case for a lot of people. You see, that's just like assumption making. When we write on assumptions, a lot of times we miss out on so many opportunities. Opportunities, so many ways in which sex can be so mutually satisfying, how we can explore and expand beyond what it was taught to us, imposed on us, expected out of us. And let's say you have the conversation. Are you down for a threesome? Those conversations that I encourage from all of you. If at any point you or your partner says no or I'm not sure, it's a full stop. It's a full stop. Threesomes are not a small thing that a person can try on a whim. It's definitely not something a partner is entitled to just as much as a partner is not entitled to solo sex, in the sense like sex between the two of you, no partner is entitled to sex. And threesomes are not a bomb for saving a relationship or saving someone's sex life. Threesomes are like toys, they're sexual aids. If your sex life is great, if this is a relationship that's mutual satisfying, that cares for one another, threesome can be wonderful. But if it's not, if this is something that is pressured by one but not ready for the other, this can damage a relationship. If there's distrust in this relationship, if we have a hard time having hard conversations, it's gonna be this will damage a relationship. And so I say this because maybe threesomes are your biggest fantasy. Maybe that's the main category of porn you watch. I would hope if you are dating, you would state that early on how important it is for you to have. And if you're already in a relationship and you express that and your partner is not interested for whatever reason, I'm sorry to tell you, but it means you're not, it does not mean you're entitled to it. There may be some sexual incompatibility, but also what I like about this topic about opening the conversation and like I mentioned before, that we can learn from queer couples is that while we're talking about threesomes, I want you to tune into yourself and think about well, what other things I want to try? What are other things I want to explore within the confines of monogamy? What are other ways in this relationship that we can improve sexually that doesn't have to include a third person? And you will find most of the time there's probably more things you both are excited and willing to do than the other way around. So it's not just about the type of sex we're having, the category of sex, the amount of partners we're having sex with. I also say this because I hear this a lot. Just because you're bi, you're bisexual, or your partner is bisexual, it does not mean you or your partner have to be down for a threesome. It does not mean that you should be down for a threesome. It does not mean it's okay for your partner to bring up a threesome when you talk about your sexuality and your bi experience. It does not mean they keep bringing it up or no, no, no, none of that. Just as much, I don't expect that coming from a straight partner towards a straight partner. I don't expect that from a bi or a pan partner. You don't do that. There's plenty of bi and pansexual folks who end up in heterosexual or monogamous relationships and they're fully content and happy and don't want to explore beyond that. I say that because I noticed that there is a fetiscization of bi folks because of how much we fantasize of threesomes. That's not okay. Your sexual orientation doesn't necessarily mean enthusiasm and it doesn't necessarily mean consent. I I have to say that. Know what you want to explore, not only with yourself, but with your partner. Know what you do like as much as you know what you don't like. Because let's say we're having the conversation about threesomes, you don't want a threesome. Okay, that's fine. But what I like about these conversations is that it does open the door of learning a lot more about your partner's sexuality and interests that just happen to seep through the cracks. When you open this door to conversation, I want you to be non-judgmental. There is a gap between what we fantasize and what we do. And some fantasies stay fantasy and they we like it being fantasy. Like I know people who fantasize about centaurs. You can't have sex with a centaur. It's not even a real thing, it's a fictional character, it's a magical creature. And so people are comfortable fantasizing about it and like the fantasy, but it doesn't mean they won't act on it. It can be really fun. It is so fun to learn about your partner. And I hope there's that enthusiasm to hear all the cool things that your partner fantasizes about. And some may be impractical, some literally physically impossible, but that's their fantasy. That's that's part of what makes them them. And I hope that you extend that nudge judgment and playfulness to them as they much as they do that to you. And so when you know what you like and you know what you want, and you open the door to these conversations, you get to learn what are things that you both find sexy and other things that you want to explore. And so when you're exploring and hearing your partner and when your partner's hearing you, I also want you to tune into yourself. Because this is the great part about all this. Because maybe they'll share fantasies you've never heard of, you never thought of, you didn't even know existed. And while they're talking about their fantasies, as much as we're talking, expressing non-judgment, I want you to tune into yourself and think, am I being turned on right now while my partner is sharing what they want to do? What they want to see me do? Or am I feeling repulsed, fear, or uncomfortable? And if it's more of the negative feelings, the next question is always why? What about this makes it uncomfortable? What about this makes it repulsive? What makes it what makes it fearful? It goes into this next point that I want to make clear. Just like other sexual fantasies, when we're considering a threesome with a partner, why would you have a threesome with a partner who does not give you pleasure? Who's not considerate of your pleasure? Who does not take the time to get to know your body, understand your body, or give you an amazing orgasm? Why would you consider a threesome with a partner who is not okay with the added element of a vibrator? Why are they not okay with a vibrator, but will be totally okay with adding a whole new person? These are questions I would really have you consider before saying yes. Because they're great. I'm gonna keep talking about how great they are and how wonderful they can be for a relationship. Let's say you both want a threesome. Great. Now we know the playground. Now let's set up the sandbox. How big this playground is, what we get to do. What this means is I want to know your limitations, your boundaries, and your negotiations and agreements with your partner about having a threesome. What are you not okay with? What are your hard no's and your maybes and your yeses? And it's also a great time to share with your partner your worries, your fears about threesomes, including whether the third person will be an acquaintance or a total stranger. And this is the part that's really cool that I found while looking up research on threesomes. There was a lot of stuff on threesomes. I was primarily looking up threesomes, including two men, because in preparing for today's episode, I was watching Zendaya bully two little twinks. They weren't little, they're probably much taller than me. I'm 4'11. They're probably like six foot, but to me, they were twinks. The really cool thing about this was that I found that men were more likely to take part in a threesome with two men and one woman when the other man is a friend that they have a bromance with. This is due to the comfort of that other person seeing them naked and to be able to laugh about it afterwards. So they're just they're more actually more comfortable having a threesome with someone they know than then someone they're they don't know. That's funny. And I found that women were more likely to take part in a threesome with two men and one woman if the men involved expressed interest in interacting with one another. It's that sound bite, I want two boyfriends and I want those boyfriends to be boyfriends. It's that. And the reason is I found this really interesting and pretty reflective of the experience of being a woman, is that it made them feel safer. When the men were interested in one another, the women did feel safer because there was less of a power dynamic, but also because they felt more comfortable if it was mutually satisfying for all of all involved. I think it's cute that women can be so empathetic sometimes and be like, I want everybody to enjoy this. You know, I don't want anyone to be the main character. That's I think that's cute in the sense that like for me to have a threesome, everyone has to touch everybody. No one's the main character. So if you want that type of threesome to happen, just know that statistically speaking, these are the elements involved that need to happen. This further along emphasizes the importance of the symbiosis of the three people involved. A significant aspect that is often overlooked in these conversations is the interaction among the people involved, the taking of the turns, the turn taking. How good are we at taking turns? It's not just the the couple, but the one beyond that. Are they good at taking turns? Things to consider. And I I think that's what closes the gap between fantasy and the reality of a threesome is understanding that not one person is the spotlight. I I say this because I I mentioned earlier in in today's episode how men find threesomes more satisfying than women, probably because the pleasure gap. If you decide to have a threesome with two women, that's that's two orgasms. That's three orgasms that need to happen. That's a lot of work. That's a lot of work. Everybody needs to be enjoying this. I hope everybody's enjoying this. Orgasm doesn't mean uh pleasure, it doesn't mean that's the goal of sex, but a lot of us like to experience them. And I hope what I'm what I'm trying to say is I hope even the person all three involved are enjoying themselves. This is not a spotlight main character thing. And I I remember reading in terms of the book, Tell Me What You Want. A lot of reasons people fantasize about threesomes or group sex is that because they like the attention, they like being the main character, but reality is not like that. Reality is everyone involved is as important as the other one. And this is another benefit about this whole conversation about having threesomes, whether if you're in a partnership or if you're single and joining another partnership, or if you're all three of you are single, is that it allows everyone to have a conversation about contraceptives and STI testing. Oftentimes, when we get into committed relationships, we throw testing contraceptives like condoms out the window without any real conversation happening. It comes with this assumption that long-term relationships are sexually exclusive, or your partner is being sexually exclusive. That might not necessarily be the case, unfortunately. On top of that, our bodies are changing, our relationship dynamics are changing. And so you might want to change contraceptive views to one or another. And that's also an aspect of family planning. When you're opening up a relationship, including a third, I hope you're having this conversation, not just about having this other person involved, but also between the two of you. Maybe there's some changes that you would like to happen and want to change, but you never, it just never came up in the conversation. These conversations are great because it builds accountability and trust. And that's what ultimately builds security in the relationship. Three Sims forces couples to talk about jealousy, not as an antagonist that ruins relationships. Rather, talk about it as a natural feeling that occurs when we are taking turns. When you address jealousy as a team rather than an individual issue, like that's your issue, you're a jealous person. No, don't do that. Don't, don't, don't ever do that. When you address it as a team, it prevents isolation and resentment that can happen during and after the threesome. So the best prevention of jealousy is having that conversation ahead of time and seeing it as a team issue, not an individual issue, and how you're gonna manage that jealousy, hard ways you're gonna prevent jealousy. This is again when we're talking about limitations, the boundaries, the expectations, the agreements. This is a good time to also include jealousy. So when we have these conversations, it can create expansiveness. I love talking about self-expansive theory. In the relationship, if we're capable of being vulnerable and handling issues of our most intimate lives, we might as well feel like we can overcome major obstacles outside of the relationship together. Notice the whole time while I speak to the audience, I'm asking you, what is it that you want? Because it is a decision that would mean that you both are able and will enjoy it. If you're finding yourself making sexual decisions more aligned with what your partner wants, without considering if you would actually enjoy it, then a threesome may very well be an extension of already existing pattern of deprioritizing your pleasure. In conclusion, what I'm trying to say is I disagree with Tori. I don't think threesomes end marriages. I think instead they're mirrors, they're erotic mirrors of patterns that already exist. In other words, if you have a great relationship, a satisfying relationship, a relationship that wants to expand in that direction in particular, and you both are enthusiastic and prioritize one another's pleasure, a threesome would be great. It brings up new conversations, new topics, it forces you to explore yourself further, to verbalize that. Go have a threesome, have a threesome for me. Okay? Have it for me, have a threesome. But if the whole time I'm talking about this, and you're in a relationship where you avoid hard topics, you avoid hard feelings, there's insecurity, insecure attachment style, there is a lot of conflict, there's a lot of silencing, there is prioritizing one over the other. If there's one main character and then there's a secondary character, there's poor communication, there's jealousy, envy. Yeah, a threesome might as well end your relationship. If that's what it takes to end the to break the camel's back, it might. It might end the relationship. I would argue probably the relationship ended before the threesome. It's a food for thought. So my take is it can grow a relationship and it can break a relationship. It's entirely up to you what you make of a threesome.